This is my idea for a way to place weapons on the inside of you'r ship.
My first idea of this is to place a , say, four by four module on the inside of your ship. From the outside this would look like a round blimp on you'r hull (and a barrel or three?) that can rotate 360 degrees. Such a turret would not allow any other external emplacements, so as to not hit them with friendly fire from the same turret.
A better idea would be to place a similar module but that shot only so many degrees forward and backwards.
See that turret? Something like that.
Another idea would be to have external rocket wings, like on helicopter, that carry a missile (Or two :D ) that and can be reloaded from the inside of the ship. Same can go with bombs: the wing extends outside the ship, drops a rocket off, and slides back inside the ship for a reload, hidden for the time by armor.
Air Lord, Engineering Corps
We already discussed side mounted weapons before (link here when I find it), the general consensus was that it removes weapon restrictions for external weapons and hurts the gameplay a bit.
But the idea of side guns having a circle range around them instead of an arc in front of them wasn't terrible.
Yes! Though it would limit you to only one side weapon, this weapon could be rather powerful and would allow some great firepower, compensation for it's singularity.
Under weapon restriction, I think that these weapons would mostly still have a limited turning angle (With exceptions...).
Commander, Engineering Corps
You could always just have it so Side mounted weapons take up much more room.
So, a Normal cannon, being side mounted takes up 2x4 instead of just 2x1. being twice as heavy as well. But allowing that extra firepower if you have the lift capacity.
You know what yeah you've changed my mind, I think it would benefit the game to have it as WolvrNZ said if it were implemented. Trading firing angle restrictions for size/weight restrictions works very well, especially for ground structures that cannot move their guns around or flip. Which makes ground structures better by being able to hit anything and everything and have stone armour without worry (not that I'm saying you cannot have ships with rotating turrets). and not to mention how landships could benefit from this as well.
Here are two visualizations:
Above is a 360 degree platform, and below is a turret similar to the one on Mark V (The tank above).
I went ahead and reworked the texture for my example. This one fits the 3*2 block size perfectly.
Edit: and oh look, I failed terribly and the thing turned out tiny. I'm sorry.
Edit Two: and now I spent fifteen minutes trying too enlargen the thing without blurting it and failed again. ;(
This is exactly one of my suggestions, except better worded and graphically displayed.
My suggestion was also misunderstood, likely because no one bothered reading my wall of text. I suggested what was interpreted as decreasing placement limitations, which is not the case.
The two firing arcs you visualised are one of the types of new weapon types which I suggested, and which could be placed inside the ship.
I also suggested that such weapons have very short range and deal less damage, along with having another placement limitation - the inability to place ANY other weapon near it, in either a 1 or 2 block radius around it, preferably 2.
Also, the weight and size part is a good idea, too, though I DID suggest that implementation earlier. (I feel ignored when people recognise such things as a good idea and a way to fix a previous suggestion that actually did contain the fix in the first place. :( )
I think all those limitations would compensate for the lack of standard limitations very nicely, while making design more interesting.
I also had more weapon suggestions with different limitations and mechanisms, but which also used the idea of "Remove the current limitations, but add different ones."
One examples would be mortars, which, while they WOULD have a no placement line, the line would be vertical or diagonal (or both), while shootings target in front of the ship. Or a weapon that needs to be fixated using a keel, restricting paths through the ship.
So, while I agree with the general consensus that placement limitations should not be removed, I think it was formed as a reaction to a misunderstanding in the first place, and that adding new weapons with different placement limitations would make designing considerably MORE interesting, not less.
It's not about absolutes, it's about balance. If done wrong, such weapons can make stuff boring and op. If done right, they can make things really fun. It's all about careful thought and balance.
"We already discussed side mounted weapons before (link here when I find it), the general consensus was that it removes weapon restrictions for external weapons and hurts the gameplay a bit."
Yes, the discussion was there, but it ignored that things that could be done to compensate for the lack of frontal restrictions, which I wrote a huge wall of text about above, and in that very topic, but it was, as I only realised later with the last couple of posts, misunderstood, either because I wasn't clear enough or because people didn't bother reading my walls of text.
But, as seen by some posts in this very topic and the other topic, if actually implemented in a specific way, the general consensus towards the suggestion is, in fact, not that negative.
Fist, I'm sorry that your posts got lost or misunderstood. But hey, graphical pictures always do the trick!
Second: thank you! This is pretty much the first time my writing was called "well worded". Being Russian and all...
Third: Here is an opinion on some of the things you mentioned (And I did, in fact, read the menacing and scary looking wall of text you marched in here with XD ) :
I think side mounted weapons should not be weaker. Its the same cannon after-all! Instead, rather than having the weapons weaker, the blocks should be bigger (and heavier!)(Logically explained by the fact that they can be turned and require mechanisms for the action). The only restriction for placing these weapons should be that side weapons CANNOT be placed in each-others firing curve. That would allow placing cannons I drew above in a vertical line, but would block pacing weapons anywhere to the front or back of the line.
[EDIT: I've done it again. Dammit. I always TRY to make my posts short, and never succeed in making them short enough.]
"Second: thank you! This is pretty much the first time my writing was called 'well worded'. Being Russian and all..."
It's clear and concise, something I often struggle with. I also tend to go in circles and repeat the same thing with a different phrasing, rambling on and on about something. So, yeah, I'd definitely say you worded it better than I did.
Also, you may be Russian, but know of native English speakers whose grammar and phrasing are worse than yours.
"I think side mounted weapons should not be weaker. Its the same cannon after-all! Instead, rather than having the weapons weaker, the blocks should be bigger (and heavier!)(Logically explained by the fact that they can be turned and require mechanisms for the action)."
Very good point, but it goes both ways. If you want a weapon the size of the cannon, the mechanism will still take up space, and therefore a weaker weapon needs to be mounted. If you make it larger than the cannon, then it can be as strong as the cannon. So, yeah, what you said makes sense, but it doesn't exactly make the idea of a weaker weapon less feasible.
"The only restriction for placing these weapons should be that side weapons CANNOT be placed in each-others firing curve. That would allow placing cannons I drew above in a vertical line, but would block pacing weapons anywhere to the front or back of the line."
Definitely a rational restriction. The "no weapons around it" idea was mainly to balance them and avoid the thing from being overpowered and being boring, but the "make the weapon turret bigger" approach is better: Effectively, it does almost the same thing, but with more limitations. Namely, if the weapon takes up more space, you can't use that space to place non-weapon modules like you otherwise could. And more limitations are exactly what we need to avoid it from making normal weapons obsolete, or being almost as good. It can also be more easily explained when it comes to lore and in-universe stuff.
The other line of sight is also a great and explainable idea. While it still leaves the problem I presented in another topic - a large ship is limited to have a smaller gun-to-size ratio, it might be necessary to avoid other, more complicated restriction systems. And, while I think the latter would benefit the game, it would be a nightmare to balance and probably tricky to implement, so I'd say the former approach better in that it would be much simpler and take less effort and development time that Zark can use on other thing if he chooses to implement the suggestion. I honestly don't expect him to implement it, but I still hope he might.
Lets be honest for a moment Lukasiak: I personally don't see any possible way for the game to exist without side placed weapons. The weapon limitations are just too much, and gameplay would be so much funner (I think?).
Secondly, I thought of this while reading another thread: why not have side mounted weapons come in three variants, each variant for a layer. So V1 would be placed directly onto the ship's side and be the lighters. V2 Would be a layer outwards (closer to the camera), have a larger base and overall be heavier and bukier. V3 would be the biggest and heaviest. All three would have the same firing properties, but you could have three weapons with forward-half firing arcs placed in a line, one right behind the others.
I don't really know if you humans understand what I mean.
My brain melted.
AHAHAH Why rsslcs?
Well, as I said before, this could make design more interesting.
However, there are two problems:
The first problem is balancing. If not done right, it will make designing ships less interesting, not more, as people could just spam weapons anywhere instead of carefully considering the placement of each module. And in this game, module placement matters. It needs to be balanced very carefully in order to avoid it. So, while I think it would be an absolutely awesome if done right, but a disaster if done wrong.
The horizontal type of turret would, indeed, be kinda like a cannon, but it firing both forwards and backwards would be a plus for the turret, so more negative aspects should be implemented.
Now, this can be easily solved by doing just what you suggested - limiting the firing direction to just forwards or just backwards.
Now, I like the idea of making the turrets bulkier than regular weapons, yet with the same power. I also like the idea of layers a lot, and the solution of having each layer be more and more demanding, yet giving the same power. However, I don't feel like size alone is enough to make turrets not overpowered and design ruining.
So, I think there should be 4 things that limit the usefulness of turrets, and each of them with an in-universe justification:
Those three aspects together would be enough to prevent turrets from being overpowered.
Now, 360 turrets could have the same first 3 limitations as regular side turrets, though perhaps even more considerable. Limitation 4 would be very big for 360 turrets. They would be obstructed by everything except layer 0 (the ship itself). So, if you have a turret on layer 1, you can't have anything else on the layer, and you can't have layer 2 or 3. Kind of a big deal, huh? That way, you could only have one 360 turret per ship, and if you want any other side turret you'd have to place your 360 on layer 2 or 3, which would be less efficient and more expensive.
Okay. With all the things I mentioned, the turrets would probably be quite balanced and a pretty nice addition.
But wait, I mentioned 2 problems. I only addressed the balancing one.
Well, the second problem would likely be implementation. I don't know how exactly it works behind the scenes, but implementing the layer mechanism would probably be pretty tricky, and when that's done Zark would still need to make the art for every type of turret for every layer, and then implement them. I imagine that would be a lot of work.
Okay, so, with all of this in mind, I think it could be possible to do without it being unbalanced, and it would make designing ships more interesting.
It would definitely be a nice addition, imo.